I don't think it is practical to currently use baseless walls. I would not recommend that.
To work with walls in FreeCAD you have to mostly manipulate the base geometry (sketches and draft 2D objects).
Which I think is not that cool vs 3D Editing in general and regarding your video about "Wall Alignment" in special (No real overview in 2D)
I agree. I think in most cases it is more practical and intuitive for user/architect to work with the wall as a 3D object than with the base 2D object.
Note that I think every BIM application has lines/sketches as a base object for walls, it just hide them from users by default.
I experience the opposite. When Editing Walls (or Wall Styles) you will get asked from which "Alignment Axis" you will base your changes - so it is flexible (VW and Bricscad)
Yes, the wall alignment is relative to the base object (line). You might move the wall or the baseline during alignment change, but I think the base concept is the same. The only difference is how it is exposed to the user.
But when I want to move or extend Walls just from Alignment Lines/axis in 2D, where I can't even estimate which type was assigned, I still have to do manually math about full or half Wall's thickness in the back of my mind ?
Yes, this is the current situation in FreeCAD. I think it is a weakness of wall creation/manipulation, as user often has to think about and calculate wall thickness offset/divide by two, etc.
I am comparing this to Revit, where you can easily create/manipulate existing walls in relation to other objects or parts of other objects.
In Bonsai, the Extend and Trim functionality helps, but there is similar limitation in manipulating walls, at least that is what I gather from my limited understanding of modelling process in Bonsai.
So I see this advantages of Bonsai compared to FreeCAD - Wall Trim tool, Wall Extend tool, Wall Joint object and wall layer behavior related to Wall Joints.
Is there really not something similar to "Extend to next Wall" as in Bonsai or Bricscad ?(
(Looks like you also had at least early Bricscad experience, which (linear Solids and Connections) was already great, not mentioning current state like "Quick Draw" refinement and everything else or my other BIM)
No there is not. This is the reason I do not recommend using baseless walls. Hopefully something will pop up, there is a GH feature request for such functionality: https://github.com/FreeCAD/FreeCAD/issues/5608
I don't know what the meaning should be. It can be an exterior wall of a simple building with rectangular footprint. I would say the advantage is that this one object shares properties for all of its parts so it's easier to change them.
Not sure yet if that's a good idea in case of element calculations and how to organize this and together with nedeed other Wall "types".
I just could not imagine it is like this as there are other components on another level already. But working with Walls for me was always "the" essential feature. I really thought you probably may just create another Wall Tutorial in this regard and just show to effectively work with Freecad Walls in the Freecad sense.
I am with you on this point. There are two strategies of modelling walls in FreeCAD - creating one parametric sketch (or several on the floor based on the wall types) or creating each wall as an independent object. There are advantages and disadvantages to both. I tend to prefer to working with independent walls, as that is the workflow I am used to from Revit. But sometimes it is cumbersome.
There is an independent SketchArch workbench with lot of features by @paullee which is tailored for the first method of modelling, I have not yet tested it: https://github.com/paullee0/FreeCAD_SketchArch
I watched one of your older Videos about creating Geometry, which was 2D only. And there came up some very cumbersome repetitive needs in 2D work also.
Yeah, that is just the case in 2D drafting in general. Sure there are some steps that you could do much more effectively in 2D CAD like BircsCAD, but as a basis for 2D documentation the Draft Workbench is quite powerful.
To not be misunderstood,
(before my Freecad post here gets deleted again)
I am aware that Freecad is "free". And I although being so direct and honest may sound harsh and not motivating, I do not have "expectations or therefore would even "demand" or "judge" Freecad in any way.
I think this is clear, as we are in an OSArch forum :). I think Bonsai and FreeCAD BIM users have to be prepared to jump through a lot of hoops to get a project done.
I don't think it is practical to currently use baseless walls. I would not recommend that.
OK, good to know. I thought since it was a new feature it would be the way to go.
Yes, the wall alignment is relative to the base object (line). You might move the wall or the baseline during alignment change, but I think the base concept is the same. The only difference is how it is exposed to the user.
I meant that in current BIM Apps ,the 3D Wall is the origin and "Baseline" is positioned dynamically from the Wall according to your current needs. Like when Wall Component changes cause a new Wall thickness, from where to expand. Or the option to reverse the Wall's direction.
No there is not. This is the reason I do not recommend using baseless walls. Hopefully something will pop up,
I wondered why Freecad Selection is by default in sub mode (Face/Edge/Vertex)
I thought I could just extend the Wall by selecting a front face and move/snap it to the next Wall but I it was not possible. Which feature is it for that you can select e.g. Faces of a 3D Object ?
Yes, the wall alignment is relative to the base object (line). You might move the wall or the baseline during alignment change, but I think the base concept is the same. The only difference is how it is exposed to the user.
I meant that in current BIM Apps ,the 3D Wall is the origin and "Baseline" is positioned dynamically from the Wall according to your current needs. Like when Wall Component changes cause a new Wall thickness, from where to expand. Or the option to reverse the Wall's direction.
Yes the user-facing behavior can be setup in various ways.
EDIT: I don't think this statement is correct: (In Revit you can choose whether the wall moves or the base line moves when you change alignment. I am not sure what the default setting is.)
I wondered why Freecad Selection is by default in sub mode (Face/Edge/Vertex)
By default, you select the sub-object, but most of the time you can work with the whole object based on the tool you select.
I thought I could just extend the Wall by selecting a front face and move/snap it to the next Wall but I it was not possible. Which feature is it for that you can select e.g. Faces of a 3D Object ?
You can use selection filter: https://wiki.freecad.org/Part_SelectFilter
But you don't need to do that, I would not recommend this tool to a beginner. You can select a wall face and use Trim/Extend tool and extrude the face. Unfortunately this creates a new object instead of just moving that face of the wall.
Thanks, that is something I would have expected ....
but it is not very intuitive as you can see here:
Yes, not really ....
I was able to manipulate one out of four of my baseless Walls - which made it rotate freely in 3D .....
I even avoid no drawing Walls in a Top View for Z shifting from snapping (?)
Currently I try to get used to the 2D Line based approach.
BTW,
What is the difference between Draft and Sketch or in BIM Workbench drawn 2D Objects ?
Yesterday I watched an 8 year old Tutorial (how to create a multy-Ply Wall)
2013 Yorik had a most elegant solution published where you basically draw all Plies as separate Walls but from a common Line Base by using different Offsets. Well, not the fastest workaround. But not without elegance ....
Because, besides you can freely control top and bottom level of each Ply/Wall Component, get cavities, .....
But i think that is mainly interesting as AFAIR I saw a Window added in such a bunch of Walls, I assume it cutted through all Walls (?).
That is remarkable that I have a problem with how current BIM Modeling usually works.
All use a System by Wall Styles/Definitions/Compositions/Types ... from outer insulation package until the inner plaster ....
The problem with this is, that such Walls may have a common Structural Component and Finishings on both sides. And sometimes such an external Wall (poured as a single element) may in between run through an interior part of the building, so needs partly no Insulation or along different Rooms that have different Finishing needs. Which will lead to
tons of needed Wall Styles easily to resemble all possible combinations of outer and inner Finishings
tons of Wall Segmentations by interrupting along a single Wall, by using parts of Walls because the need of different finishings Styles.
And I postulate that it would be far better if we had a Separation between Structural and Finishing Parts of a Building, just as it is build in reality. (First you pour Structurall Walls and Slabs, then come the Windows, then the outer Insulation/Cladding, then the Doors and inner Finishings) Basically this ends in a kind of multi-Wall Setup as that 2013 FreeCAD literally multi-Ply-Wall attempt. I think that way would be much more effective overall.
But that is not possible as there is the Problem that usually Objects creating Openings when inserted, like Doors and Windows, usually can only be assigned to a singe Wall.
(Bricscad seems to have the option to assign such an insert to multiple Objects but I have not found or could verify that)
AFAIR in the past in a Freecad Video I have also seen that in a narrow hallway, inserting a Door ate parts of unrelated Walls because the front and back (?) cut levels were set too far.
For me sounds a bit like that could be possible in Freecad.
So Freecad, which is still missing some BIM development or LOD capability, on the other hand would be still free to include such alternative Model approache in development. Which I think is exciting and motivating.
But please correct me where I misinterpreted a Flexibility separating Structural from Finishings, with Wall inserts and such in Freecad, because that may not have ever existed in such form or was already lost in later years.
But i think that is mainly interesting as AFAIR I saw a Window added in such a bunch of Walls, I assume it cutted through all Walls (?).
Yes, this can be achieved easily: place the wall in one of the walls and than adjust the 'Hole Depth' parameter so that it is larger than all wall thickness combined.
The described workflow is possible - FreeCAD gives you a lot of freedom in how to model things.
>
What is the difference between Draft and Sketch or in BIM Workbench drawn 2D Objects ?
>
Draft objects are mostly simple 2D vector objects.
Sketcher enables creation of complex parametric 2D shapes, which are sketch obejcts. This concept is quite common in your standard MCAD software.
From the software point of view these are completely different objects, which usually need completely different workflows. In FreeCAD BIM, both can usually serve as a base object for a BIM object, as can be seen on the Wall example.
Great !
thank you very much for confirming and explaining !
If I got that correct, in simple cases it may be better to just use standard "yellow" 2D Geometry from BIM or Draft Workbench. But if you want to reach some parametric and flexibility it is worth to Sketch Objects. Like e.g. a sophisticated Sketch Object that you use for all your Exterior Walls and Slabs (on all Stories at best).
Error prone may be to manage your (Wall) Axes orientations and that you need abstract and keep your Element thicknesses in mind when working with a Grid-like/Axes-based System.
For Bonsai, is the wall joint 'parametric', i.e. when either wall segment is edited / translated in position (e.g. for a T-joint arrangemnt, the other wall would automatically stretch / translated in position to keep the T-joint configuration?
If I got that correct, in simple cases it may be better to just use standard "yellow" 2D Geometry from BIM or Draft Workbench. But if you want to reach some parametric and flexibility it is worth to Sketch Objects. Like e.g. a sophisticated Sketch Object that you use for all your Exterior Walls and Slabs (on all Stories at best).
@paullee said:
For Bonsai, is the wall joint 'parametric', i.e. when either wall segment is edited / translated in position (e.g. for a T-joint arrangemnt, the other wall would automatically stretch / translated in position to keep the T-joint configuration?
Thanks
Well, I was used that it works for L-connections but I see it does not work for a T-connection.
And not really automatically ...... you move a connected Wall - and will have to press the Update Geometry button after.
But there are also all kind of Trim or Extend Tools when a Wall Selected and the Wall Tool open. Which allow to manipulate Walls
I see the best of both worlds - with individual Wall object in FreeCAD, it may face similar parametric problem, but easier and finer control and clear identity of each wall segment; with Sketch in FreeCAD, it has all the constraints which para-metrically constructed the edges layout. Maybe there be could be a bunch of 'baseless' wall segment, each follow each edges of the Sketch; now user do not have to choose between either approaches.
This is a really helpful collection for anyone getting started with FreeCAD BIM, especially the breakdown of IFC modes and practical workflows like importing files, assigning IFC classes, and building a full project (garage example 👍).
Looking forward to more tutorials—these step-by-step guides make learning much easier!
But i think that is mainly interesting as AFAIR I saw a Window added in such a bunch of Walls, I assume it cutted through all Walls (?).
Yes, this can be achieved easily: place the wall in one of the walls and than adjust the 'Hole Depth' parameter so that it is larger than all wall thickness combined.
The described workflow is possible - FreeCAD gives you a lot of freedom in how to model things.
I pulled together 3 of my existing Walls to test. (2 short ones at both sides of a longer Wall. And for a moment I thought that does not work. Extending the Cut Distance of the Window cut both short Walls - but not the long Wall in the middle ....
So it seems like this works only for Walls using the same Base !?
(I see the short Walls had the same Base fortunately)
OK, should be feasible. Likely the Insulation Package could use the same base.
Just something you have to know.
Means the Corridor Example in a Video I have seen .... all Interior Walls may have been created from the same Sketch/Draw.
BTW,
latest daily build from Wednesday brought Finder Previews for FC Files on Mac by a Quick Look Extension - a huuuuge Feature.
(Bricscad still does not offer this)
Before FC 1.1 official at least showed File Thumbnails in Start Tab, which daily builds somehow did not.
Unfortunately, now since the Quicklook extension, neither official nor daily show File Thumbnails in start anymore.
AFAIK only for Files that were not saved since ....
This tutorial explains how to setup architectural/structural grid in FreeCAD BIM. It also shows how to place the grid on TechDraw page and how to link the grid to be able to place the grid on multiple pages and drawings.
Currently I tumbled over "ArchSketch" workbench and was even able to install.
I tried to watch some of the videos to see what it does and how it works, but sorry, I don't get anything from the given documentation.
Did you had already anything of ArchSketch covered in your videos or know of other channels ?
@semhustej said:
Note that having ArchSketch installed might change some of the behaviours even in the vanilla FreeCAD BIM tools. At least that is my understanding.
Read that too ...
but I still don't get what it does in general. Tried again a bit by trial and error but did not advance. I may deactivate it again.
Like with Blender, problem with Freecad is again that every bit of any other CAD experience or muscle memory makes learning these creative UI/UX environment just harder :)
I went back to exploring most basic things like how to change the display color of an object and such ..... to get a bit used to it.
BTW,
if you don't mind .... what's the difference between a Clone and a Link ?
Which is the Block Reference/inserted Symbol/inserted Cell/..... we are all used to in CAD ?
(The one that saves memory and when the Block changes, all references adapt)
Links is a more advanced object in FreeCAD core system, which like linux file system links (created by command 'ln', in Windows it is shortcut), but with several other features like ability to create array, variants etc. It does not repeat the Shape of the Linked objects, so it save a lot file size when user has a large number of Links, e.g. hundreds of same Door type. [ See Voxelisation in https://github.com/paullee0/FreeCAD_SketchArch#9-voxelisation] Clone is an older type of object and every Clone repeat the Shape of Linked object so file system increased. Support to Links particularly in the FC BIM wb was being added so it should have more advantage, but maybe some features in the Clone still needs to be migrated.
@zoomer said:
but I still don't get what it does in general. Tried again a bit by trial and error but did not advance. I may deactivate it again.
Thanks for testing the SketchArch Add-on, there is a button in the toobar on the rightmost-hand, ArchSketchLock; un-check it, main behaviour of the Addon would not be activated - a feature requested by a user to more effectively test the difference.
Sorry documentation is poor, there were FC Forum Discussions and YouTube which explain more about the features and workflow during the development.
When the Add-on is activated, BIM wall tool creates an underlying ArchSketch rather than stock Sketch object - so it is just like ordinary Sketch base object for the moment. Add more wall segment, "if the option "join base sketches" is enabled in the Arch preferences, the resulting wall will be one object based on a sketch made of several segments. With Sketch's inherent capabilities like constraints, user can set constraints like dimension, vertical/horizontal, angle etc. to para-metrically define the wall segments layout / a floor plan.
Now, there are more augmented features with the Add-on. E.g. user can set Align, Width, Offset for individual Wall Segment - use the 2nd lefthand-most button - Edit Wall Segment Properties. Another feature is to place Arch Object para-metrically to Wall Segment - e.g. either use Window tool and use cursor to place it on a Wall segment, or use the Add-on Edit Attachment tool - select a Window then the Wall object and click this button, select the Sketch Edge it should go to. Then edit the parameters in Window like offset to para-metrically place the window - it is parametric and 'Toponaming-tolerant'. The Edit Wall button (the one with Wall image and '+') let user select / de-select which edges in the Sketch should become Wall segment or not. Likewise, the other buttons define which edges could become curtain wall, slab (structure), stairs etc. when user use the same ArchSketch as Base. Imagine a Sketch with outermost rectangle edges could be CurtainWall, the same define RC Slab, internal edges are building RC Core and internal walls.
There are things not supported yet though, more development and helps is needed :)
p.s.
As semhustej suggested, start with FC BIM core features first.
@paullee said:
Links is a more advanced object in FreeCAD core system, which like linux file system links (created by command 'ln', in Windows it is shortcut), but with several other features like ability to create array, variants etc. It does not repeat the Shape of the Linked objects, so it save a lot file size when user has a large number of Links, e.g. hundreds of same Door type. [ See Voxelisation in https://github.com/paullee0/FreeCAD_SketchArch#9-voxelisation] Clone is an older type of object and every Clone repeat the Shape of Linked object so file system increased. Support to Links particularly in the FC BIM wb was being added so it should have more advantage, but maybe some features in the Clone still needs to be migrated.
If I got that correct,
the old "Clone" is mainly a "Copy" with update option if the master changes (?)
While the "Link" is more what I know as a Cell/Symbol.
like ability to create array, variants etc.
() variants.
Was not aware of any problems with any kind of "instance copies" when used in array so far.
But "Variants" sounds more like an Autocad "Block" ... with its extra options to make "referenced Blocks" differ from each other.
I prefer the clean and simple way, an inserted e.g. Vectorworks Symbol is always an exact copy of the Symbol, saved in the Symbol Library of a file, master saved only but its duplicate's Transformations only ()
But the main thing to know is already that it is the "Link" what will keep file size and lags low. So I will concentrate on that.
there is a button in the toobar on the rightmost-hand, ArchSketchLock; un-check it, main behaviour of the Addon would not be activated - a feature requested by a user to more effectively test the difference.
I have seen that and tried a few times in on or off state but was not able to get anything happening.
(Besides that it shows a message when I used a not supported Wall without base)
When the Add-on is activated, BIM wall tool creates an underlying ArchSketch rather than stock Sketch object - so it is just like ordinary Sketch base object for the moment. Add more wall segment, "if the option "join base sketches" is enabled in the Arch preferences, the resulting wall will be one object based on a sketch made of several segments. With Sketch's inherent capabilities like constraints, user can set constraints like dimension, vertical/horizontal, angle etc. to para-metrically define the wall segments layout / a floor plan.
Now, there are more augmented features with the Add-on. E.g. user can set Align, Width, Offset for individual Wall Segment - use the 2nd lefthand-most button - Edit Wall Segment Properties. Another feature is to place Arch Object para-metrically to Wall Segment - e.g. either use Window tool and use cursor to place it on a Wall segment, or use the Add-on Edit Attachment tool - select a Window then the Wall object and click this button, select the Sketch Edge it should go to. Then edit the parameters in Window like offset to para-metrically place the window - it is parametric and 'Toponaming-tolerant'. The Edit Wall button (the one with Wall image and '+') let user select / de-select which edges in the Sketch should become Wall segment or not. Likewise, the other buttons define which edges could become curtain wall, slab (structure), stairs etc. when user use the same ArchSketch as Base. Imagine a Sketch with outermost rectangle edges could be CurtainWall, the same define RC Slab, internal edges are building RC Core and internal walls.
I think this helps,
will look into it again.
p.s.
As semhustej suggested, start with FC BIM core features first.
To understand the Clone vs Link practical difference in the BIM field, I would also recommend you to read this post by Furgo: https://forum.freecad.org/viewtopic.php?t=103648
I still don't know which one is better to use in which occasion :)
The Draft Clone command creates linked copies, clones, of selected objects. The shape of a clone is parametric, it will update if its source object changes. But a clone does have its own position, rotation, and scale, ....
Which sounds like a Draft-Clone is a typical "instance copy"
and its own View properties.
or more like Autocad Blocks, with the extra feature.
(That makes it more versatile, especially in 2D (e.g. same symbol used with different color variants), but less simple and beautiful)
But WIKI STD LinkMake says :
in the past, simple duplication of objects could be achieved with Draft Clone, but this is a less efficient solution due to its implementation, which essentially creates a copy of the internal Shape of the source object. Instead, a Link directly references the original Shape, so it is more memory-efficient.
So a Draft Clone isn't "instanced" - just a "linked copy"
And ....
For BIM objects the command creates a special type of clone: an Arch Clone.
From FC WIKI BIM WC :
Properties
A cloned BIM object is of the same type as the original object. The vast majority of BIM objects are derived from Arch Component, thus a clone shares the common properties and behaviors of all Arch Components.
When creating such a clone, most properties will not be copied over to the clone, except for the following ones, which are copied as a one-off and after creation are independent from the original object:
DataDescription
DataIfcType
DataMaterial
DataSubvolume
DataTag
And the view properties that define the appearance of the object.
And (but)
Properties that define the shape of the original BIM object are linked to it and are effectively read-only for the clone. E.g. the DataLength of a wall.
Does this make any sense (especially in the Wall example) ?
So it is not meant like e.g. a typical Wall or Window "Style" where you setup things like Frame and Sash widths - but can set individual Window Widths and Heights or number of opening Elements .....
But things like large building where you have n times the same toilet Window and when a change occurs you edit the original and all Arch Clones will follow ?
But then using a BIM Link/STD LinkMake instead of Clone would do the same - more efficient ?
Comments
I avoided to ask these questions on the Freecad Forum, as long as it all heavily based on missing knowledge and experience with Freecad :)
But I have FC Forum site open am already searching through existing Wall threads.
I don't think it is practical to currently use baseless walls. I would not recommend that.
I agree. I think in most cases it is more practical and intuitive for user/architect to work with the wall as a 3D object than with the base 2D object.
Yes, the wall alignment is relative to the base object (line). You might move the wall or the baseline during alignment change, but I think the base concept is the same. The only difference is how it is exposed to the user.
Yes, this is the current situation in FreeCAD. I think it is a weakness of wall creation/manipulation, as user often has to think about and calculate wall thickness offset/divide by two, etc.
I am comparing this to Revit, where you can easily create/manipulate existing walls in relation to other objects or parts of other objects.
In Bonsai, the Extend and Trim functionality helps, but there is similar limitation in manipulating walls, at least that is what I gather from my limited understanding of modelling process in Bonsai.
So I see this advantages of Bonsai compared to FreeCAD - Wall Trim tool, Wall Extend tool, Wall Joint object and wall layer behavior related to Wall Joints.
No there is not. This is the reason I do not recommend using baseless walls. Hopefully something will pop up, there is a GH feature request for such functionality: https://github.com/FreeCAD/FreeCAD/issues/5608
I am with you on this point. There are two strategies of modelling walls in FreeCAD - creating one parametric sketch (or several on the floor based on the wall types) or creating each wall as an independent object. There are advantages and disadvantages to both. I tend to prefer to working with independent walls, as that is the workflow I am used to from Revit. But sometimes it is cumbersome.
There is an independent SketchArch workbench with lot of features by @paullee which is tailored for the first method of modelling, I have not yet tested it: https://github.com/paullee0/FreeCAD_SketchArch
Yeah, that is just the case in 2D drafting in general. Sure there are some steps that you could do much more effectively in 2D CAD like BircsCAD, but as a basis for 2D documentation the Draft Workbench is quite powerful.
I think this is clear, as we are in an OSArch forum :). I think Bonsai and FreeCAD BIM users have to be prepared to jump through a lot of hoops to get a project done.
Thanks,
OK, good to know. I thought since it was a new feature it would be the way to go.
I meant that in current BIM Apps ,the 3D Wall is the origin and "Baseline" is positioned dynamically from the Wall according to your current needs. Like when Wall Component changes cause a new Wall thickness, from where to expand. Or the option to reverse the Wall's direction.
I wondered why Freecad Selection is by default in sub mode (Face/Edge/Vertex)
I thought I could just extend the Wall by selecting a front face and move/snap it to the next Wall but I it was not possible. Which feature is it for that you can select e.g. Faces of a 3D Object ?
That seems very interesting !
BTW,
there aren't that many Wall threads on the FC Forum, nor any complaint about.
Yes the user-facing behavior can be setup in various ways.
EDIT: I don't think this statement is correct: (In Revit you can choose whether the wall moves or the base line moves when you change alignment. I am not sure what the default setting is.)
By default, you select the sub-object, but most of the time you can work with the whole object based on the tool you select.
You can use selection filter: https://wiki.freecad.org/Part_SelectFilter
But you don't need to do that, I would not recommend this tool to a beginner. You can select a wall face and use Trim/Extend tool and extrude the face. Unfortunately this creates a new object instead of just moving that face of the wall.
So after all there is a tool which enables baseless wall stretching, but it is not very intuitive as you can see here: https://github.com/FreeCAD/FreeCAD/issues/29512#issuecomment-4276885236
Thanks, that is something I would have expected ....
Yes, not really ....
I was able to manipulate one out of four of my baseless Walls - which made it rotate freely in 3D .....
I even avoid no drawing Walls in a Top View for Z shifting from snapping (?)
Currently I try to get used to the 2D Line based approach.
BTW,
What is the difference between Draft and Sketch or in BIM Workbench drawn 2D Objects ?
Yesterday I watched an 8 year old Tutorial (how to create a multy-Ply Wall)
2013 Yorik had a most elegant solution published where you basically draw all Plies as separate Walls but from a common Line Base by using different Offsets. Well, not the fastest workaround. But not without elegance ....
Because, besides you can freely control top and bottom level of each Ply/Wall Component, get cavities, .....
But i think that is mainly interesting as AFAIR I saw a Window added in such a bunch of Walls, I assume it cutted through all Walls (?).
That is remarkable that I have a problem with how current BIM Modeling usually works.
All use a System by Wall Styles/Definitions/Compositions/Types ... from outer insulation package until the inner plaster ....
The problem with this is, that such Walls may have a common Structural Component and Finishings on both sides. And sometimes such an external Wall (poured as a single element) may in between run through an interior part of the building, so needs partly no Insulation or along different Rooms that have different Finishing needs. Which will lead to
And I postulate that it would be far better if we had a Separation between Structural and Finishing Parts of a Building, just as it is build in reality. (First you pour Structurall Walls and Slabs, then come the Windows, then the outer Insulation/Cladding, then the Doors and inner Finishings) Basically this ends in a kind of multi-Wall Setup as that 2013 FreeCAD literally multi-Ply-Wall attempt. I think that way would be much more effective overall.
But that is not possible as there is the Problem that usually Objects creating Openings when inserted, like Doors and Windows, usually can only be assigned to a singe Wall.
(Bricscad seems to have the option to assign such an insert to multiple Objects but I have not found or could verify that)
AFAIR in the past in a Freecad Video I have also seen that in a narrow hallway, inserting a Door ate parts of unrelated Walls because the front and back (?) cut levels were set too far.
For me sounds a bit like that could be possible in Freecad.
So Freecad, which is still missing some BIM development or LOD capability, on the other hand would be still free to include such alternative Model approache in development. Which I think is exciting and motivating.
But please correct me where I misinterpreted a Flexibility separating Structural from Finishings, with Wall inserts and such in Freecad, because that may not have ever existed in such form or was already lost in later years.
Yes, this can be achieved easily: place the wall in one of the walls and than adjust the 'Hole Depth' parameter so that it is larger than all wall thickness combined.
The described workflow is possible - FreeCAD gives you a lot of freedom in how to model things.
>
>
Draft objects are mostly simple 2D vector objects.
Sketcher enables creation of complex parametric 2D shapes, which are sketch obejcts. This concept is quite common in your standard MCAD software.
From the software point of view these are completely different objects, which usually need completely different workflows. In FreeCAD BIM, both can usually serve as a base object for a BIM object, as can be seen on the Wall example.
Great !
thank you very much for confirming and explaining !
If I got that correct, in simple cases it may be better to just use standard "yellow" 2D Geometry from BIM or Draft Workbench. But if you want to reach some parametric and flexibility it is worth to Sketch Objects. Like e.g. a sophisticated Sketch Object that you use for all your Exterior Walls and Slabs (on all Stories at best).
Error prone may be to manage your (Wall) Axes orientations and that you need abstract and keep your Element thicknesses in mind when working with a Grid-like/Axes-based System.
For Bonsai, is the wall joint 'parametric', i.e. when either wall segment is edited / translated in position (e.g. for a T-joint arrangemnt, the other wall would automatically stretch / translated in position to keep the T-joint configuration?
Thanks
A simple video demonstration of what works and not in FreeCAD wall, base-less, based on Sketch etc.
At 1:37, it demonstrate about Sketch's constraints capabilities.
Exactly.
Well, I was used that it works for L-connections but I see it does not work for a T-connection.
And not really automatically ...... you move a connected Wall - and will have to press the Update Geometry button after.
But there are also all kind of Trim or Extend Tools when a Wall Selected and the Wall Tool open. Which allow to manipulate Walls
Thanks.
I see the best of both worlds - with individual Wall object in FreeCAD, it may face similar parametric problem, but easier and finer control and clear identity of each wall segment; with Sketch in FreeCAD, it has all the constraints which para-metrically constructed the edges layout. Maybe there be could be a bunch of 'baseless' wall segment, each follow each edges of the Sketch; now user do not have to choose between either approaches.
Thanks for sharing these tutorials!
This is a really helpful collection for anyone getting started with FreeCAD BIM, especially the breakdown of IFC modes and practical workflows like importing files, assigning IFC classes, and building a full project (garage example 👍).
Looking forward to more tutorials—these step-by-step guides make learning much easier!
I pulled together 3 of my existing Walls to test. (2 short ones at both sides of a longer Wall. And for a moment I thought that does not work. Extending the Cut Distance of the Window cut both short Walls - but not the long Wall in the middle ....
So it seems like this works only for Walls using the same Base !?
(I see the short Walls had the same Base fortunately)
OK, should be feasible. Likely the Insulation Package could use the same base.
Just something you have to know.
Means the Corridor Example in a Video I have seen .... all Interior Walls may have been created from the same Sketch/Draw.
BTW,
latest daily build from Wednesday brought Finder Previews for FC Files on Mac by a Quick Look Extension - a huuuuge Feature.
(Bricscad still does not offer this)
Before FC 1.1 official at least showed File Thumbnails in Start Tab, which daily builds somehow did not.
Unfortunately, now since the Quicklook extension, neither official nor daily show File Thumbnails in start anymore.
AFAIK only for Files that were not saved since ....
Oh, I see. What you can do to punch hole through all walls in this case is
The result is that the Window is child object of all three walls and the hole goes through all of them.
This tutorial explains how to setup architectural/structural grid in FreeCAD BIM. It also shows how to place the grid on TechDraw page and how to link the grid to be able to place the grid on multiple pages and drawings.
The new tutorial explains how to create and work with architectural section line symbols in FreeCAD BIM:
Currently I tumbled over "ArchSketch" workbench and was even able to install.
I tried to watch some of the videos to see what it does and how it works, but sorry, I don't get anything from the given documentation.
Did you had already anything of ArchSketch covered in your videos or know of other channels ?
I have not yet tested the SketchArch WB yet, as there are so many things to explore in the vanilla FreeCAD :)
@paullee could help for sure if you have concrete questions. He works on the WB quite intensively so the videos you watched might be out of date.
Note that having ArchSketch installed might change some of the behaviors even in the vanilla FreeCAD BIM tools. At least that is my understanding.
Read that too ...
but I still don't get what it does in general. Tried again a bit by trial and error but did not advance. I may deactivate it again.
Like with Blender, problem with Freecad is again that every bit of any other CAD experience or muscle memory makes learning these creative UI/UX environment just harder :)
I went back to exploring most basic things like how to change the display color of an object and such ..... to get a bit used to it.
BTW,
if you don't mind .... what's the difference between a Clone and a Link ?
Which is the Block Reference/inserted Symbol/inserted Cell/..... we are all used to in CAD ?
(The one that saves memory and when the Block changes, all references adapt)
Links is a more advanced object in FreeCAD core system, which like linux file system links (created by command 'ln', in Windows it is shortcut), but with several other features like ability to create array, variants etc. It does not repeat the Shape of the Linked objects, so it save a lot file size when user has a large number of Links, e.g. hundreds of same Door type. [ See Voxelisation in https://github.com/paullee0/FreeCAD_SketchArch#9-voxelisation] Clone is an older type of object and every Clone repeat the Shape of Linked object so file system increased. Support to Links particularly in the FC BIM wb was being added so it should have more advantage, but maybe some features in the Clone still needs to be migrated.
Thanks for testing the SketchArch Add-on, there is a button in the toobar on the rightmost-hand, ArchSketchLock; un-check it, main behaviour of the Addon would not be activated - a feature requested by a user to more effectively test the difference.
Sorry documentation is poor, there were FC Forum Discussions and YouTube which explain more about the features and workflow during the development.
When the Add-on is activated, BIM wall tool creates an underlying ArchSketch rather than stock Sketch object - so it is just like ordinary Sketch base object for the moment. Add more wall segment, "if the option "join base sketches" is enabled in the Arch preferences, the resulting wall will be one object based on a sketch made of several segments. With Sketch's inherent capabilities like constraints, user can set constraints like dimension, vertical/horizontal, angle etc. to para-metrically define the wall segments layout / a floor plan.
Now, there are more augmented features with the Add-on. E.g. user can set Align, Width, Offset for individual Wall Segment - use the 2nd lefthand-most button - Edit Wall Segment Properties. Another feature is to place Arch Object para-metrically to Wall Segment - e.g. either use Window tool and use cursor to place it on a Wall segment, or use the Add-on Edit Attachment tool - select a Window then the Wall object and click this button, select the Sketch Edge it should go to. Then edit the parameters in Window like offset to para-metrically place the window - it is parametric and 'Toponaming-tolerant'. The Edit Wall button (the one with Wall image and '+') let user select / de-select which edges in the Sketch should become Wall segment or not. Likewise, the other buttons define which edges could become curtain wall, slab (structure), stairs etc. when user use the same ArchSketch as Base. Imagine a Sketch with outermost rectangle edges could be CurtainWall, the same define RC Slab, internal edges are building RC Core and internal walls.
There are things not supported yet though, more development and helps is needed :)
p.s.
As semhustej suggested, start with FC BIM core features first.
Thanks @paullee !
If I got that correct,
the old "Clone" is mainly a "Copy" with update option if the master changes (?)
While the "Link" is more what I know as a Cell/Symbol.
() variants.
Was not aware of any problems with any kind of "instance copies" when used in array so far.
But "Variants" sounds more like an Autocad "Block" ... with its extra options to make "referenced Blocks" differ from each other.
I prefer the clean and simple way, an inserted e.g. Vectorworks Symbol is always an exact copy of the Symbol, saved in the Symbol Library of a file, master saved only but its duplicate's Transformations only ()
But the main thing to know is already that it is the "Link" what will keep file size and lags low. So I will concentrate on that.
I have seen that and tried a few times in on or off state but was not able to get anything happening.
(Besides that it shows a message when I used a not supported Wall without base)
Now, there are more augmented features with the Add-on. E.g. user can set Align, Width, Offset for individual Wall Segment - use the 2nd lefthand-most button - Edit Wall Segment Properties. Another feature is to place Arch Object para-metrically to Wall Segment - e.g. either use Window tool and use cursor to place it on a Wall segment, or use the Add-on Edit Attachment tool - select a Window then the Wall object and click this button, select the Sketch Edge it should go to. Then edit the parameters in Window like offset to para-metrically place the window - it is parametric and 'Toponaming-tolerant'. The Edit Wall button (the one with Wall image and '+') let user select / de-select which edges in the Sketch should become Wall segment or not. Likewise, the other buttons define which edges could become curtain wall, slab (structure), stairs etc. when user use the same ArchSketch as Base. Imagine a Sketch with outermost rectangle edges could be CurtainWall, the same define RC Slab, internal edges are building RC Core and internal walls.
I think this helps,
will look into it again.
Will keep this in mind.
To understand the Clone vs Link practical difference in the BIM field, I would also recommend you to read this post by Furgo: https://forum.freecad.org/viewtopic.php?t=103648
I still don't know which one is better to use in which occasion :)
From the FC Wiki :
Which sounds like a Draft-Clone is a typical "instance copy"
or more like Autocad Blocks, with the extra feature.
(That makes it more versatile, especially in 2D (e.g. same symbol used with different color variants), but less simple and beautiful)
But WIKI STD LinkMake says :
So a Draft Clone isn't "instanced" - just a "linked copy"
And ....
From FC WIKI BIM WC :
A cloned BIM object is of the same type as the original object. The vast majority of BIM objects are derived from Arch Component, thus a clone shares the common properties and behaviors of all Arch Components.
And (but)
Does this make any sense (especially in the Wall example) ?
So it is not meant like e.g. a typical Wall or Window "Style" where you setup things like Frame and Sash widths - but can set individual Window Widths and Heights or number of opening Elements .....
But things like large building where you have n times the same toilet Window and when a change occurs you edit the original and all Arch Clones will follow ?
But then using a BIM Link/STD LinkMake instead of Clone would do the same - more efficient ?
Yeah it's a mess :)