@topologic thank you for the workshop offer, it's very generous.
I would like to learn how to automate the extraction of geometry from a detailed IFC to make a clean and simple topologic model from which areas can be extracted for thermal envelope calculations, thermal analysis, sun studies and so on. I don't know if this is too simple or too hard for a workshop topic?
@topologic I'm back again, I would also like to learn how to get topologic to do concept plans and test them. I'm thinking of listing the rooms required, each with specific rules, dimensions, area, orientations etc. and then they join themselves into building with its specific rules and the whole thing tests itself for orientation, envelope complexity and so forth. All culminating in one or several iterations of designs while I'm drinking a latte:)
@Nigel these are great suggestions. One of my MSc students just completed her dissertation on exactly what you have described regarding concept plans. But it took her months and she used machine learning and evolutionary optimisation to solve it. So I am afraid both suggestions are quite complex for a half day workshop. Once the assessment of the dissertations is complete, I will share the videos that they have created.
Hi @Nigel as you see there hasn’t been a huge response so perhaps the idea of a workshop is not needed? Regardless, I am always happy to meet and help with topologic workflows. Ping me anytime to schedule a zoom session if you need any help with Topologic. Best wishes.
Hold on there Wassim. The workshop is a great idea. It's an opportunity to have a look at Topologic dealing with everyday tasks. I am just trying to figure out what I would like to see someone doing with it.
I haven't had the time yet to start testing it as for me it's still is a bit overwhelming: I don't use Blender regularly, I don't use Sverchok or any other parametric modeling software, I haven't even installed Topologic yet, and though I am hugely interested in it, I must find the time to start with it. A workshop is a great opportunity for me.
So, having said this, for me the workshop would be nice as a simple how to start with topologic and how to achieve something useful at a conceptual level. I imagine that my workflow with Topologic would start to assume a transitional form between what I do right now and a more parametric workflow. The thing is that I don't believe in revolutions, but I figure it's very easy to evolve.
So, the question for me is: How does topologic allow us to evolve on our processes instead of how it should impose a full 180º turn that changes everything.
I have been directly drawing 2D or 3D models of my buildings for a long time, so I'm not that much concerned about having topologic automatically modeling the building for me, I'm more concerned, at an initial stage, in having topologic checking if I'm doing something wrong in terms of connection between spaces and on the relations I'm creating in my buildings. If topologic is used to check my work and point my mistakes, I can move faster.
I would start by how to integrate topologic in the initial conceptual stage of organization of a building in a context:
1 - Translating a functional program to an organization schematic map of the building in topologic;
2 - Checking if our layout of spaces, that we have drawn ourselves in 2D or 3D, matches the schematic map. Example: A simple warning that the room has less area or more area than it's stated in the organizational map; or warning that the direct connection between auditorium and foyer is missing; or that the foyer has no connection with exterior spaces if those are objectives of the initial program.
3 - How these spaces we create interface with the building's context: acesses, orientation, surrounding buildings, green areas, etc... Example: I imagine this means that a road is a cell, a neighbouring building is a cell , a green area is another cell and that these cells are fixed in place, and we want the new cells we create to relate to them somehow.
4 - How to integrate things like orientation of the building, wind direction in this workflow?
5 - Then, how should topologic help us extruding these 2D spaces so their height is the same as in the program
6 - Then how should we pack spaces into multiple levels and create floors and floor connections with topologic. How to represent a stair or an elevator or ramp.
7 - Topography. Is the terrain another cell? is it geometry that imposes on cells or that imposes themselves to? How to deal with this?
I would pretty much end the workshop there and maybe this is already too much.
Other workshops would be about:
Exporting a topologic model into Ladybug tools and making use of it.
Integrating engineering as schematic planing in a topologic workflow.
Revisiting what you did a few posts before about the thickness of walls
At what level of detail should we dive with topologic from this point forward.
How to export and integrate a topologic model with other software and, if possible, keep it dynamically linked with the schematic base we did in Blender.
@JQL Some really interesting ideas! We had done a basic version of the space programme checking idea a few years ago so we can definitely enhance that and accomplish it. I think we can start with that.
Ok so I will schedule and announce a workshop soon. We’ll see how many attend. This will obviously use Topologic/Sverchok.
Fantastic. Been away from the thread for a while and got back just in time to catch up on these developments and the scheduled workshop. Looking forward to it. Thanks @topologic for plugging at it.
Hi everyone. Just to update you. First, the workshop has been published on the osarch events page (thanks @Moult) I just completed the sverchok/topologic definition for the workshop. Basically, you will invent a space programme and define the desired adjacency using an Excel/CSV file. You will then build your project by slicing through an overall volume. This can be as simple or as complex as you like. I will then show you how to quickly add doors so one can move through the project using only doors. We will use placeholders with custom attributes to specify the room name (eg LivingRoom, Bedroom1, Bedroom2 etc). These need to match exactly the names you use in the CSV file. We will then find the shortest path between pairs of rooms and compare the travel distance to the values in the CSV file and Color-code the paths accordingly. It is quite a challenging definition, but I will get you through it systematically and in chunks. We will record the session and I will send you files etc to get you started. You do NOT need to know Blender or sverchok or Topologic.
@JQL said:
Hi @topologic do you think we will have time, during the workshop, to deviate into possible variations of your approach?
If you mean on an individual basis, it depends how comfortable you are with it. I was planning to finish in 90 minutes and suggest to participants to do a simpler variation in the last 30 minutes where they colour-code the floor of the Cells by how much they vary from the areas specified in the CSV space programme.
Do you have something more specific in mind?
look forward to the workshop. Possible to extend your sverchok/topologic definition above by showing how one could apply a simple blenderbim ifc wall type to the exterior envelope, for example?
@theoryshaw said:
look forward to the workshop. Possible to extend your sverchok/topologic definition above by showing how one could apply a simple blenderbim ifc wall type to the exterior envelope, for example?
Sadly we are not there yet. While Homemaker has the python code to convert Topologic entities to IFC, we do not yet have that as a sverchok node. Obviously, you can thicken the faces into a Cell and that can be ready to be converted to IFC using BlenderBIM itself.
@LaurensJN said:
I'd very interested but unfortunately I'm traveling these hours, so I won't be able to join... Will you share a recording link afterwards here?
Yes I will. Just in case you had not registered for the webinar. Here is what I sent them:
Please find below a link to a ZIP archive containing some startup files that you will need for tomorrow’s workshop. To prepare for this workshop, you need to:
Download and install the latest Sverchok (https://github.com/nortikin/sverchok) The way I do it is as I click the Green code button and download the ZIP archive. Do NOT unzip.
If you have downloaded all add-ons, the order of activation should be:
a. Sverchok
b. BlenderBIM
c. Topologic
d. Homemaker
To install an add-on, open Blender, go to Edit->Preferences then click on Add-ons then Install… and then point to the downloaded ZIP archive. Once it appears, click the checkbox to activate it.
Test that everything works: Open the TopologicWorkshop-Start.blend file and check if you see initial geometry and initial nodes on the right. Also, check that the Topologic menu appears under “Add”
We will follow the tutorial in the included PDF file. Feel free to familiarise yourself with the steps listed in it.
The webinar will include time for Q&A after the end of the tutorial.
I have a doubt in this step. There are two versions of BlenderBIM one is for python 3.7 and the other is for python 3.9.
How do I decide which one to donload? How do I know which version of python I'm using?
Turn it off and then on again is always good advice! ?. But seriously, it did not activate because sverchok was not activated for some reason. A restart must’ve activated it.
Comments
@topologic thank you for the workshop offer, it's very generous.
I would like to learn how to automate the extraction of geometry from a detailed IFC to make a clean and simple topologic model from which areas can be extracted for thermal envelope calculations, thermal analysis, sun studies and so on. I don't know if this is too simple or too hard for a workshop topic?
@topologic I'm back again, I would also like to learn how to get topologic to do concept plans and test them. I'm thinking of listing the rooms required, each with specific rules, dimensions, area, orientations etc. and then they join themselves into building with its specific rules and the whole thing tests itself for orientation, envelope complexity and so forth. All culminating in one or several iterations of designs while I'm drinking a latte:)
@Nigel these are great suggestions. One of my MSc students just completed her dissertation on exactly what you have described regarding concept plans. But it took her months and she used machine learning and evolutionary optimisation to solve it. So I am afraid both suggestions are quite complex for a half day workshop. Once the assessment of the dissertations is complete, I will share the videos that they have created.
@topologic I'm happy to learn anything I can
Hi @Nigel as you see there hasn’t been a huge response so perhaps the idea of a workshop is not needed? Regardless, I am always happy to meet and help with topologic workflows. Ping me anytime to schedule a zoom session if you need any help with Topologic. Best wishes.
Hold on there Wassim. The workshop is a great idea. It's an opportunity to have a look at Topologic dealing with everyday tasks. I am just trying to figure out what I would like to see someone doing with it.
I haven't had the time yet to start testing it as for me it's still is a bit overwhelming: I don't use Blender regularly, I don't use Sverchok or any other parametric modeling software, I haven't even installed Topologic yet, and though I am hugely interested in it, I must find the time to start with it. A workshop is a great opportunity for me.
So, having said this, for me the workshop would be nice as a simple how to start with topologic and how to achieve something useful at a conceptual level. I imagine that my workflow with Topologic would start to assume a transitional form between what I do right now and a more parametric workflow. The thing is that I don't believe in revolutions, but I figure it's very easy to evolve.
So, the question for me is: How does topologic allow us to evolve on our processes instead of how it should impose a full 180º turn that changes everything.
I have been directly drawing 2D or 3D models of my buildings for a long time, so I'm not that much concerned about having topologic automatically modeling the building for me, I'm more concerned, at an initial stage, in having topologic checking if I'm doing something wrong in terms of connection between spaces and on the relations I'm creating in my buildings. If topologic is used to check my work and point my mistakes, I can move faster.
I would start by how to integrate topologic in the initial conceptual stage of organization of a building in a context:
1 - Translating a functional program to an organization schematic map of the building in topologic;
2 - Checking if our layout of spaces, that we have drawn ourselves in 2D or 3D, matches the schematic map. Example: A simple warning that the room has less area or more area than it's stated in the organizational map; or warning that the direct connection between auditorium and foyer is missing; or that the foyer has no connection with exterior spaces if those are objectives of the initial program.
3 - How these spaces we create interface with the building's context: acesses, orientation, surrounding buildings, green areas, etc... Example: I imagine this means that a road is a cell, a neighbouring building is a cell , a green area is another cell and that these cells are fixed in place, and we want the new cells we create to relate to them somehow.
4 - How to integrate things like orientation of the building, wind direction in this workflow?
5 - Then, how should topologic help us extruding these 2D spaces so their height is the same as in the program
6 - Then how should we pack spaces into multiple levels and create floors and floor connections with topologic. How to represent a stair or an elevator or ramp.
7 - Topography. Is the terrain another cell? is it geometry that imposes on cells or that imposes themselves to? How to deal with this?
I would pretty much end the workshop there and maybe this is already too much.
Other workshops would be about:
Is this OK?
@JQL Some really interesting ideas! We had done a basic version of the space programme checking idea a few years ago so we can definitely enhance that and accomplish it. I think we can start with that.
Ok so I will schedule and announce a workshop soon. We’ll see how many attend. This will obviously use Topologic/Sverchok.
Interested in @JQL bullet points, 1 to 4, and 6 :)
(whilst starting to build those 'cells' in FreeCAD .)
I would like the workshop too!
@JQL well expressed.
@topologic I vote for that workshop.
Is there some pre-reading/video watching that would help.?
How about Monday 15 November starting at 10:00 am GMT?
@Nigel the playlist on YouTube is a good starting point.
Would do recording? Probably wont' fit everybody in different timezone :)
@duncan can someone add it to the osarch calendar?
Hi everyone, I looked at my calendar and Friday the 19th works better. So, I just submitted the event to the osarch calendar. Here is the information:
Topologic Workshop
Friday 19 November 2021 at 16:00 GMT
Duration: 2 hours
Zoom webinar registration link: https://cardiff.zoom.us/webinar/register/WN_qLwlMDRZRsaOkNFGn2dFFA
Requirements:
Mac, Linux, or Windows computer
Blender 2.93 or newer (http://blender.org)
Sverchok (https://github.com/nortikin/sverchok/archive/refs/heads/master.zip)
Latest developer build of BlenderBIM (https://github.com/IfcOpenShell/IfcOpenShell/releases)
TopologicSverchok 0.6.0.4 or newer (http://github.com/wassimj/topologicsverchok/releases)
Fantastic. Been away from the thread for a while and got back just in time to catch up on these developments and the scheduled workshop. Looking forward to it. Thanks @topologic for plugging at it.
Hi everyone. Just to update you. First, the workshop has been published on the osarch events page (thanks @Moult) I just completed the sverchok/topologic definition for the workshop. Basically, you will invent a space programme and define the desired adjacency using an Excel/CSV file. You will then build your project by slicing through an overall volume. This can be as simple or as complex as you like. I will then show you how to quickly add doors so one can move through the project using only doors. We will use placeholders with custom attributes to specify the room name (eg LivingRoom, Bedroom1, Bedroom2 etc). These need to match exactly the names you use in the CSV file. We will then find the shortest path between pairs of rooms and compare the travel distance to the values in the CSV file and Color-code the paths accordingly. It is quite a challenging definition, but I will get you through it systematically and in chunks. We will record the session and I will send you files etc to get you started. You do NOT need to know Blender or sverchok or Topologic.
Hope to see many of you on Friday!
Hi @topologic do you think we will have time, during the workshop, to deviate into possible variations of your approach?
If you mean on an individual basis, it depends how comfortable you are with it. I was planning to finish in 90 minutes and suggest to participants to do a simpler variation in the last 30 minutes where they colour-code the floor of the Cells by how much they vary from the areas specified in the CSV space programme.
Do you have something more specific in mind?
look forward to the workshop. Possible to extend your sverchok/topologic definition above by showing how one could apply a simple blenderbim ifc wall type to the exterior envelope, for example?
Not at this moment. I'm sure I'll have during the workshop.
Sadly we are not there yet. While Homemaker has the python code to convert Topologic entities to IFC, we do not yet have that as a sverchok node. Obviously, you can thicken the faces into a Cell and that can be ready to be converted to IFC using BlenderBIM itself.
No problem. Kind of figured. :) Look forward to these worlds colliding, however.
did you end up sending these?.. i might have missed it.
No not yet, sorry. Will send later tonight.
I'd very interested but unfortunately I'm traveling these hours, so I won't be able to join... Will you share a recording link afterwards here?
Yes I will. Just in case you had not registered for the webinar. Here is what I sent them:
Please find below a link to a ZIP archive containing some startup files that you will need for tomorrow’s workshop. To prepare for this workshop, you need to:
a. Sverchok
b. BlenderBIM
c. Topologic
d. Homemaker
Download the material ZIP archive from: https://bit.ly/30zGRhw
I have a doubt in this step. There are two versions of BlenderBIM one is for python 3.7 and the other is for python 3.9.
How do I decide which one to donload? How do I know which version of python I'm using?
EDIT: No worries, tried both and only 3.9 worked.
Yes I should’ve mentioned that since Blender 2.93 uses python 3.9, everything will have to use python 3.9
I'm having issues. It seems topologic didn't install correctly:
EDIT:
Again, nevermind. Strangely enough I opened it again and it now worked:
Turn it off and then on again is always good advice! ?. But seriously, it did not activate because sverchok was not activated for some reason. A restart must’ve activated it.